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civic amp/wires/sub install


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stockcivic 
Member - Posts: 28
Member spacespace
Joined: June 24, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 12:33 AM / IP Logged  

alright guys, my first post here and I must confess I am a car audio newbie! hopefully you guys can offer some guidance. I just bought a single alpine SWR-1241D subwoofer (12" 4ohm 300w rms) and a KnuKoncepts 4 gauge amp wiring kit. I have a sony xplod mp3 head unit. I need help with putting in the wire kit mostly- along with everything else.

First, which amp should I get? I was looking at like a rockford fosgate punch 300s or 400s amp, they are cheap and there seems to be a good deal of satisfaction with them. any other suggestions on powering this sub (i picked 4 gauge wire just in case I ever went bigger I wouldn't have to tear up my car again)?

my big problem is I need to install the amp wiring and I have never done that before, I am good with cars and DIY and stuff but I feel I may need some guidance here. if anybody has installed on a 96+ honda civic please help me out here!!!!! like how do I get power cable through the firewall (supposedly there are auxiliary boots that come out underneath the battery)? and how does the power cable attach to the battery, do I need to buy a new terminal or something? I understand that I am not supposed to run the power cable with the RCA cables, I will need to run them down opposite sides of the car correct? and finally how do I get those wires under all that carpeting, panels, seats etc.?

I will deal with the rattles and the construction of my box later- if you could provide answers to any of the long line of questions above that would be GREAT!!!!!!!!!!

chevylove 
Copper - Posts: 51
Copper spacespace
Joined: June 21, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 1:09 AM / IP Logged  
Don't worry man it's not as hard as you think.  First off you can get the power line through the firewall simply by threading it through the rubber piece that seals around the harness coming from the engine compartment, unless you feel the need to drill a hole in which case you would seal it off w/ silicon.  I dunno if you installed your own deck or not but if you did do the opposite and take it out.  You'll need to do so to connect the remote and rca's.  All you need to do is run the wires on the underside of the dash until you hit the floor trim.  Take off all the floor trim which is nothing more than a big jigsaw puzzle w/ a few screws in it.  Peel up the carpet just a tad and run the wires under it.  I can't remember if the backseat of a civic pops up or not, probably not but if it does it becomes obvious how to get the wires to the trunk.  If it doesn't just keep running it under carpet and/or trim and you'll find it's way.  One of my first ever installs was in a civic and I did fine and i'm sure you will to.
Drew   "Fuses are only 10 cents...go for it."
wvsquirrel 
Gold - Posts: 1,237
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Joined: July 27, 2002
Location: Florida, United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 1:27 AM / IP Logged  
For starters, here's a link to Crutchfield's Online Learning Center. They have a lot of the basic install info you asked about.
The Alpine SWR-1241D is a 4ohm DVC sub, 300RMS 1000Peak.
The RF Punch 300s is rated 75x2@4ohms, 150x2@2ohms, 300x1@4ohms mono.
The RF Punch 400s is rated 100x2@4ohms, 200x2@2ohms, and 400x1@4ohms mono.
Since you only have one SWR-1241D, you can only wire safely into 2 or 8 ohms. The 8ohms wont do you any good, so that leaves you with the 2ohm option. Neither of those RF amps are stable at 2ohms mono. I would suggest looking for a Class D mono amp rated at 300 to 500 RMS @ 2ohms. Since your sub's Max is 1000 watts, you could use a JBL BP600.1 amp. They're not too expensive, and they are 1ohm stable (which is perfect if you ever get a second SWR-1241D). You would get apx 600watts to the sub, which is still well within it's power range. If you got a second SWR-1241D and wired both subs in parallel for a 1ohm load, you would get 300 watts to each sub, which is a perfect match.
There are still other Class D amps out there that will do the immediate job at hand at 2ohms, but I'd recommend looking into the JBL BP600.1
4-gauge was a wise choice. It will save you time in the long run.
I don't know where the access points are in your firewall.
You shouldn't have to buy a new battery terminal. Most amp kits have a ring connector that can be attached to the screw/bolt that clamps your existing battery terminal to the battery.
Correct, run the power cable and all signal cables down opposite sides of the vehicle. If they have to cross over each other at some point (for whatever reason), make sure you cross them at a 90 degree angle (like a cross, or perpendicular to each other) to minimize interference.
To run the wires, you may need to remove the seats, carpet, and possibly some panels. If you can't get the right location by removing the kickpanels and pulling the edge of the carpet up, then you will probably have to remove the seats and carpet completely. After the wires are installed and everything is in place, you can reinstall everything. Just make sure to test everything before you put the car back together! It sucks having to either re-trace wires or take the car back apart if something doesn't work right! Work smarter, not harder...
If you plan on waiting to install the amp until later, hook it up first to ensure your wiring is correct, then remove the in-line fuse from the 4-gauge power wire (should be within 18 inches of the battery). That way you wont have a hot wire just laying around in the car (major fire potential)
Squirrel
"No more Cpt. Kirk chit chat"
If its too loud, then you're too old
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stockcivic 
Member - Posts: 28
Member spacespace
Joined: June 24, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 10:59 AM / IP Logged  
okay, thanks for all of that help!!!!!!! I think I can figure out the wire installation, I think I will buy that amp too, so now I need to worry about constructing the box- do you guys know any kind of numbers, like the "Q" (not sure where to find that) or dimensions of ported boxes that really work with this sub? I know I need to learn how to build a box to a sub and make all those calculations, anybody know where I can learn all of that?
esmith69 
Gold - Posts: 1,511
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Joined: November 26, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 11:45 AM / IP Logged  

I highly recommend building a sealed box unless for some reason you really really want to have a ported box.  Ported boxes are a lot harder to make and it's so much easier to mess up just one tiny spec and have the whole thing sound like crap.  With a sealed box everything is a lot easier.  But it remains up to you.

That sub should have a sealed enclosure with an internal volume of 0.85 cu. ft.;  if you went with a ported box, 1.25 cu. ft. is the internal volume you'd want to be shooting for.  Also it would need a port 4" in diameter and 13" long.

Some of these calculators will help you out with the particular dimensions you'd want to have for your box, depending on what shape you decide to make it in.  When I made my first box I used a free DOS program called BlauBox from blaupunkt.  It's a little tricky to figure it out and it acts kind of quirky sometimes, but it proved invaluable for me because I was building a box like "wedge enclosure 2".

It's kind of hard to explain, but if you look at the photos from those calculators here at  the12volt.com, notice that although the calculator itself will account for material thickness, the picture does not.  Needless to say you're not going to be using paper-thin materials, and just imagine what your box would look like if you did not angle-cut one of the boards where it meets the other board.  You'd have two boards that would both touch each other at an angle, and only their edges would touch.  Not only is this not sturdy at all, but it's not a very good seal and it leaves a huge chunk of empty space at the front.  Very tacky.

But when you use the blaubox program, it takes into account the material thickness as well as the dimensions of each side. basically all you have to do is tell it what box style you want, what the internal volume should be,  and what size woofer it will be for.  It will put on the screen the dimensions of each piece of material, and also angles of all the cuts.  Supposedly it can print this stuff out for you but I never was able to figure out how to get that part to work.

Also I should point out that the box I made was kind of like this design, and so I had to worry about a few different angles, and that's where the blaubox program really helped me.  If you just want to make a plain old triangle wedge, the angles are pretty easy to figure out on your own.

Fortunately we have a table saw that can be adjusted to cut up to a 45 degree angle, and so for me making the angled cuts wasn't all that hard.  Also it had a brand new carbide tooth blade (MDF is not exactly the easiest material to cut throughcivic amp/wires/sub install -- posted image.).  If you don't have access to a radial arm saw or a table saw, I highly recommend you just buy an enclosure rather than trying to build one yourself, unless you're willing to spend like 3 days to work on it.

Anyways, enough with my schpiel, check out this page for a lil more info if you're still interested.

Ethan
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"Patience, persistence, and perspiration make an unbeatable combination for success"
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fuseblower 
Silver - Posts: 403
Silver spacespace
Joined: June 25, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 12:08 PM / IP Logged  

Stock Civic the link below should help you out with your install.  I don't know if you have keyless entry but if you remove the radio you will no longer be able to operate certain features of your car.  As for your box if you want to maintain trunk space opt for a sealed enclosure.  If you don't care about trunk space go with a ported box, it requires less power.

In regards to the battery you will probably have to change your battery post because it is top mount and it will not be easy to add an additional wire.  Also, while under the hood you may think about replacing the ground wire, this will stabalize the flow of current to and from the amp.

In regards to your amp the choice is really up to you and what you are trying to achieve and how much you want to spend.  I agree with wvsquirrel, the JBL amp is a nice amp.  Actually I just did an install consisting of a JBL 600 and it is a very impressive amp.  Trust me the neighbors and the car at the red light will definitely hear you coming. 

http://www.installdr.com/InstallDocs/Honda/Civic.html

stockcivic 
Member - Posts: 28
Member spacespace
Joined: June 24, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 3:12 PM / IP Logged  

thanks for all the help here, with those calculators I think I can manage building a box myself (I took 2 years of woodshop and am continuously building projects). Do any of you guys use anything to kill resonances in your boxes, such as fiberglass insulation and stuff?

Are there any other amps you might suggest, that might be a little cheaper, like maybe by MTX, kenwood, pioneer, any else? I would like that JBL but I have to make sure I find it CHEAP

I already have a head unit so I am pretty sure I just hook up some rca outputs off the back of HU, I am familiar with installing and removing it. now I just have to wait for everything to ship, then begin the install!!!

esmith69 
Gold - Posts: 1,511
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Joined: November 26, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: June 25, 2003 at 4:54 PM / IP Logged  

$199 on Ebay

For inside the box, the general rule of thumb is to use approx. 1 lb of poly-fill type stuffing per cubic ft. of enclosure volume, although a lot of times I don't like to use that much.  This is a little bit more than you'll need but you don't have to use all of it at once.

You might be able to find it cheaper at a fabric store, but they probably will only sell you it in much larger quantities (for example enough to stuff a pillow).  Same thing goes for the pink owens corning type insulation--unless you have some extra lying around it's going to be hard to purchase such a small amount.  Performance-wise I don't think there's any difference between poly-fill and fiberglass insulation.

Ethan
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"Patience, persistence, and perspiration make an unbeatable combination for success"
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stockcivic 
Member - Posts: 28
Member spacespace
Joined: June 24, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: June 26, 2003 at 2:02 PM / IP Logged  
cool! my friend and I just built the box, using blaubox to design it, f**king kicks ass. I will go get some fiberglass insulation at home depot or something then I am set. where can I get the sub box carpet, is it cheap? I will post some pictures I am pretty proud of this box
esmith69 
Gold - Posts: 1,511
Gold spaceThis member has made a donation to the12volt.com. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: November 26, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: June 26, 2003 at 2:25 PM / IP Logged  

I know we sell it in the installation bay at Best Buy.  I think we charge like 11 or 12 bucks.  Crutchfield sells it too I believe, as well as the fiber fill.  Let me know how the insulation thing at home depot goes....I have a feeling they're going to try and sell you one of those big 4 ft. in diameter rolls cuz I don't think they come in smaller sizes.  but hey it's worth a try.

One thing I'd recommend is to check out this link about how to do the carpet.  It can be a little tricky and let me just say I really wish I had something like that to guide me along when I put carpet on my first box.  I was so proud of the box and all, and then when I put carpet on it I did a crappy job and while it didn't ruin the look, I think it looks kinda cheesy as compared to before.civic amp/wires/sub install -- posted image.

Ethan
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"Patience, persistence, and perspiration make an unbeatable combination for success"
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