Alternator upgrade advice

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invictuz

Member - Posts: 28

Joined: February 05, 2005

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 7:58 AM / IP Logged

[u]Question[/u]

Where can i find a good HO alternator that requires little or no modification to stock electrical system (other than bigger cable or install bracket mounts).

Based on info below is the bigger alternator the right solution?

(from what i have read it appears to be but i find alot of conflicting info on +/- of more batteries, bigger caps, second alternators etc...)

[u]Problem[/u]

I like it loud and hard all the time [i](i'm the guy pounding down the freeway at 6am, then quitely pulling into the garage at work, then pounding as soon as i hit i90 at 6pm)[/i].

if i drop below about 1200RPM (25mph or lower) i watch my dash voltometer drop from about 13v to 10v. If i do not catch it my "check battery" light comes on at 9v and some times stalls the truck (even if still driving under 10mph).

hard notes (outcast/speakerbox track 1, any Baby Anne or Q/Uberzone) on highway (at 2200rpm+) and i still see the needle sway.

[u]Goal[/u]

I am trying to locate an 200+ amp (ideally 300) alternator for under 350$ that i can install (= basic cable replacement / minor bracket install, nothing more difficult than the self install of the below equipment...).

[u]Vehicle/current config:[/u]

1997 Jeep Grand Cherokee w/5.2liter

120 amp alternator (already upgraded from stock 90amp)

Alpine 9833 control unit w/3 4 volt pair of outs

Biggest battery i found at Schucks (not optima)

4X RF 301m

4X MTX81044a DVC (one 301m per MTX)

2X JVC AX4750 (powers infinitys)

4X 6000CS Infinity (each door)

2X 1001T Infinity

4X .5 farad caps (one for each 301m)

4 way Distribution/fuse block (aka MTX DIST)

2 way Distribution/fuse block (aka JVC DIST)

8g running from battery to MTX DIST (17 feet)

8g running from MTX DIST to JVC DIST (1.5 inches)

10g running from MTX DIST channel to each .5 farad

12g running from JVC DIST channel to each JVC amp

10g running from each .5 farad to RF 301m

12g running from each 301m to each MTX

[u]Scalability [/u]

researching a midbass/midrange solution for near future addition.

adding two more MTX after if refine fiberglass skill (2X MTX means 2X RF 301m's)

possibly upgrading 301ms to P6001bd RF P6001bd

[u]Closing[/u]

ok...think that covers it...any suggestions/advice/links are greatly appreciated!

thanks

stevdart

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Joined: January 24, 2004

Location: Pennsylvania, United States

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 9:06 AM / IP Logged

Nice Jeep, BTW. You have a problem with insufficient wiring gauge. And useless stiffening capacitors. I recommend that you take the 4 caps out of the install and sell them to some unsuspecting misfortunate on fleabay. Also, and more importantly, upgrade the audio system wiring. Figure out your total maximum wattage/amperage pull and use this chart to find proper wire sizes. Right off the top of my head, I will tell you that 8 ga. is absolutely the smallest size you should have anywhere in that system, and the main power wire should be no less than 2 ga.

The V-8 Jeep's original wiring in the engine bay should already be beefier than normally found in most vehicles, so I'll guess that it may not need an upgrade. But you can clean up the connections. There is no sense talking about increasing alternator output with the wire you currently are using. And I didn't see you mention the word 'ground'...the wiring there is as critical as the power wire.

With that much done, contact Alterstart for an alternator for your Jeep.

Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.

invictuz

Member - Posts: 28

Joined: February 05, 2005

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 9:15 AM / IP Logged

stevdart:

Thanks for the quick advice!

about an hour before posting this i ordered a spool of 0 gauge (all six amplifiers = 1200rms / 4000max). i have a few more subs and amps in the garage that i plan on adding once i have fiberglassing down...

i have been considering removing the .5 farads as i can detect a difference in long bass notes after the first second or so...not sure if solid "quick" bass is worth the barely audible (i can hear it but friends i demo the problem too cannot) difference from beginning to end of longer notes.

thanks again!

stevdart

Platinum - Posts: 5,816

Joined: January 24, 2004

Location: Pennsylvania, United States

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 9:22 AM / IP Logged

The extension of bass notes has to do with the enclosures, not the caps. And possible vehicle resonance. Something to work on (adjusting enclosure volume, adding more sound damping to vehicle) after you get your power needs met.

And try to use the least number of amplifiers to power your audio. For every one you add, you are also adding heat and inefficiency.....which equates to lost power through heat dissipation.

Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.

invictuz

Member - Posts: 28

Joined: February 05, 2005

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 9:25 AM / IP Logged

also just noted an error when i went down to my truck...

correct wiring:

8g running from battery to MTX DIST (17 feet)

8g running from MTX DIST to JVC DIST (1.5 inches)

10g running from MTX DIST channel to each .5 farad

10g running from JVC DIST channel to each JVC amp

10g running from each .5 farad to each RF 301m

12g running from each 301m to each MTX

12g running from each JVC to infinity

invictuz

Member - Posts: 28

Joined: February 05, 2005

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 7:02 PM / IP Logged

Stevdart

Thanks for your help.

After receiving valuable feedback from you and others i have come up with this plan.

Is this the order you would address improvements?

first: upgrade cable

second:install sound absorbtion material

third:bigger alternator (i already have a reply from 4alterstart.com...205amp for 250$)

fourth finish fiberglassing my garage/house/driveway/neighbors dog and build a 6 sub enclosure.

fifth: install proper midbass

sixth: upgrade components (including amps)

seventh: enjoy with a twist of lemon d ;-)

this was the first install for me and a learning experience.

Over the last year i spent 6 months stacking speakers, cables, amps, and more cables in a closet. When no more would fit i spent 4 days solid installing it all. In the 6 months since i have filled that same closet with experiences, solutions, "lessons learned" and more ideas.

stevdart

Platinum - Posts: 5,816

Joined: January 24, 2004

Location: Pennsylvania, United States

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 10:18 PM / IP Logged

The first 3 look good. But I recommend you rethink the way you intend to add amplifiers (per my previous post). Upgrade your front components as a priority if the sound is lacking, and done properly you should be enjoying great midbass with those. The damping in the front doors will make a huge impact in the midbass. Plan, plan, plan. Use the least amount of vehicle power draw to obtain the highest amount of watts with the least amount of power loss thru heat. I would look at reducing the 4 301m mono amps to one bigger amp.

Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.

invictuz

Member - Posts: 28

Joined: February 05, 2005

Posted: February 05, 2005 at 11:03 PM / IP Logged

stevdart:

i am looking into that now.

know anyone that could use a couple of 301m's? i think i will sell four and keep two (though may sell all)

thanks for the advice...i am taking it...what a nightmare dealing with gain and crossover matching and the extra space/wires...

though alot of people commented on them visual display of have the glowing red fosgate logo everywhere when you looked in the back at night!

invictuz

Member - Posts: 28

Joined: February 05, 2005

Posted: February 06, 2005 at 3:25 AM / IP Logged

bass-end of project codename: Sloppy Joe

Alternator upgrade advice -- posted image.

To replace or not to replace; that is the question!

supradude

Silver - Posts: 915

Joined: September 21, 2004

Location: South Carolina, United States

Posted: February 06, 2005 at 6:40 AM / IP Logged

I agree with everything except buying from alterstart. If you do and have problems with it? I'll just say this, I hope you'll have better luck than me.

'85 Toy

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