Inverted or regular mount

Well, I'd have to admit it would compliment the "spining" grills quite effectivly.

They sent us one set for sale, one for display. I am sure by now the displays are toast, missing or beaten up but the one for sale has so much dust on it you can barely tell what it is.

I told the sales floor that if they ever called and asked me "how much to install the spining grills" that I would reach through the phone and stangle them..lol

I want to thank you for all your input.  The design I came up with for my box required me to install it with the magnet side out.  Reason being...the box needed to be as flat as possible so I wouldn't lose trunk functionality...

Here's a pic looking from the cabin into the trunk with the rear seats folded down.

I asked the question mainly because I'm considering a ported version of this box and I wanted to know if it mattered which way the sub was installed.

One advantage I've noticed over an inverted mount in the sealed box is that no matter what I put in the trunk, no matter how full or empty the trunk is...the bass output doesn't change since it's firing into a defined space that doesn't change, as opposed to if it was mounted regularly and you start filling the trunk with stuff...the bass changes because you're now changing the environment that that sub is firing into.

Well I would imagine as long as the cone of the sub itself wasn't block it will move the same amount air. Regardless,with all else being equal I don't feel there should be any noticable difference in sound but I do agree there can always be circumstances that might have an affect.

I like your setup and it makes sense utilizing the space you are working with. However keep in mind that depending on the frequency you wish to tune the box if changing to vented will generally require a larger enlosure as well as room for the port. Since your enclosure needs to be so short, slot porting is the way to go. Find out the airspace and port volume reccomended for your sub and take it from there.

Good Luck.

Well...one installer looked at it and suggested that I lift the sub up a little bit by inserting a ring or two to create more space between the face of the cone and the bottom of the box.  The way that box is designed, it originally had approx. .9 cu. ft. (for the Xenon sub), but when I put the Alpine in...it called for about .6 cu. ft.  So...I inserted a baffle that blocked off the section that runs the length of the amp and now it's between .5 & .6 cu. ft.  He suggested that I take the baffle out and let the Alpine work in the .9 cu. ft. space if I want more bottom end on it.

The porting (if I did it) was going to be a simple tube port since I can cut the hole and insert the tube.  The outlet was going to aim towards the back of the seat where there's about 3-4 inches of space between the edge of the box and the actual back of the seat.  That way I don't have to worry about it ever getting blocked.  I think a slot port for this particular box would create too many intricacies in building it.  I'm still trying to keep the slim design.  I might be able to port it running it at the .9 cu. ft.  I'll build a test box and see how it goes.

I do like some of the ideas that were passed on though...aluminum tubing to run the wires through...could add to the aluminum look I already have back there between the amp and the cap.  Now I just have to decide which sub I'm going to put back in there when I get them all repaired.  The Audiobahn is rated at 600 watts, but...a lot of folks seem to be giving Audiobahn a bad rap.  The Phoenix Gold (which lasted the longest of the 3) is rated at 450 watts, but...it loves the bigger enclosure.  The Alpine (500 watts)...well, you see how it looks and it seems to hit nicely.  Now that I think about it...the Alpine seemed to work better when the box was at .9 cu. ft.  It didn't go out until after I took it down to .5 cu. ft.  What you think???

Mike

By "go out" I assume you mean the alpine sub blew. Logic would deduct it was being overpowered. If anything, making the enclosure smaller should have allowed even greater power handling.

Too small a box and too big a box both are not good for thier own reasons. I always try to stay as close as possible to the manufactures reccomendations for optimal performance and life. But you still need to watch the power because one of the many things I am learning here is that an amp can produce quite a bit more then it's rated RMS power if overdriven and setup improperly, hence the blown subs. If you haven't read the many posts on this topic I recently tried to blow a sub using an amp with 10 times less rms rating then the sub. Not only did the sub perform surprisingly well, I was not able to destroy it, and believe me, I tried. The amp gave out after 3-4 hours however, that was due to my test procedures which basically toasted it.

I have alot of faith that under normal usage the sub and amp would have survived.

As far as porting it can make a nice improvement to your lower end output (3db theoretically) but it must be done properly or you will lose performance and in the worst case greatly reduce the power handling of the sub at certain frequencies. You also need to take port noise into consideration. The diameter and placement can effect this. also the length needed my not physically fit into a small enclosure, which is why I suggested slot porting. However, flex port might do the trick if needed and,space permitting.

As you stated, take this into consideration when deciding on the sub. Find out the airspace and port volume needed and if the diameter fits make sure the length will as well. If you are going to use an amp that could overpower the sub adjust the gain appropriatly and conservativly or expect to blow another one.

Yes...I did mean that the sub the blew.  So if using a sub that's more closely rated to the output of the amp...the Audiobahn is rated at 600 watts.  What's funny, the sub with the lowest RMS wattage lasted the longest on this amp.  The Xenon sub lasted a few months, the Alpine lasted about a month and a half and the Audiobahn lasted all of two days.

Now maybe I didn't have the gains set properly, but I'm sure amplifying a signal that's already amplified could have caused some problems.  I'm hoping the signal line driver will do the trick of cleaning up the signal.

If overpowering would be a big problem, then why would a 200 watt sub be able to handle a 600 watt amp and not blow?  I ask this only because I've seen it for myself.  The guy has an all Memphis system except for the Phoenix Gold Bass CUBE signal processor.  He says that is the reason he can feed 600 clean watts to a 200 watt sub and not fry it.  Is there any truth to that?

I know slight overpowering is fine in most cases...if I recall correctly, someone said 20-25% over the listed RMS wattage is fine in the right application (I'm assuming a sealed box of the proper volume). 

The other problem I have is that the Alpine Tech (directly from the main company) told me that the Type-R sub is more than capable of handling 600 watts, that the 500 watt RMS listing is a conservative wattage for that sub.  He said feeding it up to 1000 watts is doable, but you start getting up into the red zone and end up pushing to failure.

From what I have gathered about "overpowering", it doesn't simply take into account the ratings of the components. It is how they are used. Theoretically ,I would think you could use an amp with as much power as you wanted within reason, as long as it was set up correctly and not overdriven or abused (played at levels so loud that you can actually hear damage beginning).

There could be a few factors as to why some subs lasted longer then others in your case. But the bottom line is they blew due to overpowering them in one way or another. The "dirty" input is a contributor, enclosure specs and the ability of the different subs and thier components to handle the thermo/mechanical stresses are another factor. Gain settings as well are a major factor as mentioned.

Aside from how the system is used and setup, I would think that moderation is the safest bet either way. Reagardless of the ratings being lessor or greater then the subs, there is no reason that with proper setup that the subs should suffer a premature death.

Hope I explained this well enough.

another thing not disscussed is the final ohms load at the amp. I am not aware of the ohms setup for any of the subs you had but that will have a major effect on power output if not taken into consideration. And if the amp is not one ohm stable and you are dropping below 2 ohms a great chance of clipping can occur and drive up the power considerably as mentioned earlier.

As far as what Alpine told you I sell the type r's and have had several blow. I know none of them had ampliflers of 1000 watts rms but probably 600w at the most. But once again they were overpowered due to any or all of the factors I mentioned, and this is what caused them to die.

Alot of my customers turn up the gain themselves, even after I warn them of the pending disastor if doing so. Some how they got the impression that the gain control is a volume control or they see me lowering it while setting up the system. They question me thinking I am purposly lowering the power of the amp so as not to damage the sub. They are partially correct, I am doing it purposly to save the sub(s) but am not changing the specs of the amp. Simply matching it to the decks output voltage, the volume control on the deck will still make it louder but they get so hung up on the "number" of the volume display that they can't seem to grasp the logic.

Once again it was more about how the system was used (or abused) that caused the blown subs, not the specs of the amp or sub per say.