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how to get more volume out of my system?


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3rd gen 
Member - Posts: 31
Member spacespace
Joined: December†11, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: March†31, 2007 at 3:28 PM / IP Logged  
I have a 2001 Eclipse GT. Here is my current set up:
HU: Eclipse CD7100
Front Speakers: Infinity Kappa Perfect 6.1
Rear Speakers: Infinity Reference 6x9's
4-Channel: Eclipse XA4000
Subwoofer: Eclipse SW7000
Mono-Block: Eclipse XA1000
I set my gains on the XA4000 using the clipping light built into the amp. I had the volume up to about 67 out of 80, and then set the gains just before the point where the clipping light comes on.
I want to know if there was any way that I could get more volume out of my system and still keep the clarity? I find myself listening to it at around 60 out of 80 on the freeway most of the time. I do not want to listen to it maxed out all the time, but I want to be able to turn it up a bit more when a song I like comes on.
ferretvw 
Copper - Posts: 188
Copper spacespace
Joined: September†29, 2005
Location: Pennsylvania, United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 12:01 AM / IP Logged  
First of all I would do a search for adjusting the gain as just looking at the light is not the most accurate way. That headunit has 8v preouts if I remember correctly so on that amp I believe you want the gain all the way down. The number that the headunit goes to is basically arbitrary it doesn't really mean much I have installed basically that same setup numerous times and it always sounds awesome so I guess I don't understand what exactly you are looking for just more volume or what?
2008 Scion xB
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aznboi3644 
Gold - Posts: 2,600
Gold spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: May†01, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 1:36 AM / IP Logged  
what enclosure is your sub in??
3rd gen 
Member - Posts: 31
Member spacespace
Joined: December†11, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 1:51 AM / IP Logged  
The gain is pretty much all the way down. I figured the clipping light wasn't very accurate so I positioned the setting pretty far from where the point at which the light goes on (better to err on the safe side that the light was too sensitive to clipping than not sensitive enough).
Yes I know the actual number the HU goes to is arbitrary, but the ratio of volume number to max is pretty standard. 3/4 full volume is still 3/4 full volume. Shouldn't it be almost unbearably loud at 67/80 (83% to full)?
Yes I am looking for more volume and I know turning up the gain is NOT the way to get that volume. I guess all I can do is add more sound deadening??
My sub is in a generic 0.85 ft^3 mdf enclosure. The sub levels are fine, I just want my kappa perfect's to be louder.
speakermakers 
Copper - Posts: 231
Copper spacespace
Joined: January†02, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 2:18 AM / IP Logged  
I have extensive experience selling and installing the very equipment that you have. The answer is a line driver. The xa4000 and xa1000 are capable of much more than the 8 volts that your deck can belt out. Using a device like an Audiocontrol Matrix you can maximize your systems headroom. You simply wonít believe the difference in output. I know because I sell and install this setup almost daily (because its great!), and every once in a while a customer will not go for the matrix and I see what thatís like too.
Go to Audiocontrols website and download the gain setting tech paper. Setting gains on a line driver is different than most people think. Plus getting quality info from a great company like Audiocontrol is always a good thing.
3rd gen 
Member - Posts: 31
Member spacespace
Joined: December†11, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 9:20 AM / IP Logged  
speakermakers, that looks like a really nice piece of equipment. I will definitely look into that.
forbidden 
Platinum - Posts: 5,352
Platinum spaceThis member has made a donation to the12volt.com. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Mobile Audio and Video. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: November†01, 2003
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 3:10 PM / IP Logged  

Um, this guy would not be. The Matrix is not going to do much for you in this application when you have a 8volt rms output. If the customer wants louder, more power, more speakers is the way to go. All more input voltage is going to do, and a marginal amount at that, is afford him to allow the gain to go lower. If he is taking the amp to full putput, the amp is going to make the same amount of power with 2 volts as it will with 8 up until the point of clipping. So again, more power, more speakers. Louder is primarily a function of a subwoofer, look to a second sub and a second XA1000.

Top Secret, I can tell you but then my wife will kill me.
Silvrefox 
Copper - Posts: 126
Copper spacespace
Joined: August†11, 2005
Location: Oklahoma, United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 9:40 PM / IP Logged  
forbidden wrote:

If the customer wants louder, more power, more speakers is the way to go. . So again, more power, more speakers. Louder is primarily a function of a subwoofer, look to a second sub and a second XA1000.

Huh? Now that's a sales pitch I'd love to see in my shop. At least if successful. As far as the more volume pitch, I could get on that boat all the way if I was to get the right answer to one question: Do you want a louder overall system or just subs?
I've been watching this post with some interest because I myself want more overall output with maximum clarity. I do love me some serious kickbass (bout 60-150hz, tight and fast, ya know?), but gotta carry some serious lows. For example, Korn's Blind, that's my jam! The sub bass in that song is so low and loud, but when the rest of the music kicks in, very punchy and raw. I also want that loud.
Now you fellas driving your Bugattis to the marina to get on your weekend yacht are gonna tell me go buy 4 sets of Focal Utopia 3 ways, fiberglass me a new dash and doors, power 'em up with the JBL crown amps, find myself the most obscure and ridiculously expensive subwoofers, and finally trade in my first-born for exotic materials from the four corners of the earth to effectively deaden my car. Is that about right?
That is, as I already stated, ridiculous. Now, am I saying that I will achieve my goal with WalMart's best? No way. But I do believe in tuning and placement. I myself have the problem that I would like to use most of my stock locations and achieve this and I drive an 04
Stratus sedan. Yup, by-9s in all four corners with Polk db tweets in the front to just bring that stage up a bit, 1 10" CompVR in the trunk all being powered by MTXs 5-channel Blue Thunder (old school, baby) being run by a Kenwood Excelon KDC-X589. Sound great to moderate volume, but I start distorting at about 3/4 twist. Any takers?
dwarren 
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Platinum - Nominee spaceThis member has made a donation to the12volt.com. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: December†03, 2004
Location: California, United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 10:25 PM / IP Logged  

Yes, your gain is improperly set. What amp specifically do you have? the 5400x? If so that amp is only rated at about 25 watts per channel at 4 ohms, which will put some volume limitations there as well.

Forbidden is right on. There is no substitute for displacement and power. Plain and simple no matter how effecient a speaker claims to be, two will always out do it with the equal power porportion.

As far as kick bass and low range mid bass, your sub section provides an incredible support system. Even if you have your sub crossed over at about 80 hertz, the key is high pass cross over and how well it blends with the rest of the system. If done right, it literally sounds as if the bass is coming form the front speakers, you can't even place where the bass is coming from, i call it blending well. Like my IDQ's do so well.

3rd gen 
Member - Posts: 31
Member spacespace
Joined: December†11, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: April†01, 2007 at 10:35 PM / IP Logged  
forbidden wrote:

Um, this guy would not be. The Matrix is not going to do much for you in this application when you have a 8volt rms output. If the customer wants louder, more power, more speakers is the way to go. All more input voltage is going to do, and a marginal amount at that, is afford him to allow the gain to go lower. If he is taking the amp to full putput, the amp is going to make the same amount of power with 2 volts as it will with 8 up until the point of clipping. So again, more power, more speakers. Louder is primarily a function of a subwoofer, look to a second sub and a second XA1000.

Thanks for the correction forbidden! I was looking forward to an answer from you an haemphyst.
I am already wanting a second SW7000 and XA1000, but I want my interior speakers, more specifically my front kappa perfects, to be louder.
So would going with say, Boston Pro60's make a large difference in volume? Since the are 3 ohm speakers, they would draw more power from the amp and therefore play louder and clearer, correct?
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