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electrified interior components


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pyroguy 
Member - Posts: 18
Member spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2007
Location: United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 8:45 PM / IP Logged  

Greetings all!

This past Easter weekend a couple of idiots thought it would be great to try and jack my '86 Monte Carlo SS. This would be the 4th attempt in 5 years (and yes, the car is worth it!) and every time a theft attempt happens they just show me where the weakpoints are in my car's security - like an audit.

Here are the occurences and my response to each occurence: (if you are not interested in reading this feel free to jump further down. This next section just lays out the experiences with all the theft attempts I have had in the past).

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2002: Thief breaks driver's side window and steals tool bag. (Not a very saavy car thief) Response: Installed Clifford alarm system. Installed redundant collapsable kill switches. Don't leave loose items in car in plain sight.

2004: (new) Thief Slim-Jims driver's side door, breaks steering column (under a security camera I might add, so the playback was quite educational). Kill switches saved the day. Response: Repair column and minor damage. No further action.

2005: (new) Thief uses slide hammer on driver's side door lock. Breaks steering column (again). Response: Installed Steadfast armored steering column guard to minimize the expense of future column repairs. (Got tired of dishing out $120 every time I need my column repaired). Added another kill switch. Shaved the handles and locks off the side of the car (doors open via remote control now).

Easter 2007: (new) Thief slim-jims the door (which was supposed to have been fixed when I shaved the handles. Back to the drawing board on that one...), rips the trim piece off the dash below the sterring column, pops hood and disables the alarm siren (cut the ground wire), _tries_ to break into the column (haha punk, its reinforced this time), rips open the side of my center console to try and get to the alarm electronics (which isn't there, genious), and is interrupted by other people walking by as well as the ensuing police cars. Response: Will revise the door linkages so a slim-jim will not work, mount redudant alarm sirens (with one in the cabin for the purpose of drawing blood through the eardrums), armor the wiring to the siren in the engine compartment so the wires cannot be cut, fabricate a replacement dash trim piece from 10ga stainless steel (formely plastic), reinforce the center console with 10ga steel, and finally contemplate electrifying certain components of the interior.

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So, my question to everyone is what are you thoughts on electrifying certain components of a car's interior - and of course they will only go active in the situation where the alarm has been activated. I have read some similar posts regarding electrifying the door handles of the car, but in the end the risk to innocent people (like idiotic children with no concept of courtesy or responsibility) caused the idea to be scrapped.

What I am thinking is that I could fabricate a system of parrallel plates mounted to the underside of the trim peice that must be removed to get to the column. This seems like a great focal point for a system like this because a would-be thief will have to remove the trim peice for their purposes, and of couse the innocents will be spared because the system will only act on those who have commited to breaking the law.

More on the plate system: Twin metal plates mounted to the underside of said trim piece and separated via several dielectric barriers. One plate would be grounded while the other is connected to an automotive ignition coil. The coil is then connected to a suitable 555 timer based pulsing circuit (like this one.. http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/5322/coildrv.htm - which I already have two that are firing my exhaust flamethrower system).

Once the car's alarm is tripped one of the available outputs from the alarm system will trigger a relay which will then allow 12v to flow into the 555 timer circuit and thereby activate the shocking system. Once the thief reaches up under the trim piece and bridges the twin plates with his hand - the circuit would be complete. ZAAAPPP!

Now, the question of the hour, what do you guys think of legality? I know it is one thing to endanger innocent bystanders (no matter how discourteous they might be), but perhaps it is another to hurt someone already engaged in a felonious act against your own self? 

All constructive comments would be greatly appreciated. And if you have any legal background in personal property protection I would be in your debt!

Thanks guys!

(BTW: I did contemplate one alternative to this high-voltage device - which was the installation of a semi-truck air horn or a cruise-liner foghorn in the cabin of my car. Think that would be a great deterant?)

- Jesse

creed2k 
Copper - Posts: 99
Copper spacespace
Joined: March 31, 2007
Location: United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 9:32 PM / IP Logged  
this idea reminds me of the magnavolt on robocop 2... lol
but damn that is a lot of breakins in a short period of time really, and i agree with u that car IS worth it.. hands down the nicest monte ever made... as far as legality goes for that kind of a setup, with the dumb things people sue for now days, i wouldnt do it, thats just my opinion tho.
auex 
Platinum - Posts: 5,041
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Joined: December 23, 2002
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 9:54 PM / IP Logged  
How does prison sound? It is illegal. Anything that is intentionally used to harm a person is a felony.
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pyroguy 
Member - Posts: 18
Member spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2007
Location: United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 10:04 PM / IP Logged  

Auex,

You might be absolutely correct; but unless someone can site me specific legal statues (more specifically Missouri state statutes) then comments like these are just conjecture and assumption.

Regardless, I will not be putting this method of theft deterance into practice until absolutely sure of its legality.

- Jesse

auex 
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Posted: April 10, 2007 at 10:55 PM / IP Logged  
It is illegal in all 50 states. Search your local government law library for the term "Man Trap". I did it a couple times before but it is a pain in the butt. You could always consulta lawyer. It is the same as someone intentionally laying out a bear trap to catch a human.
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Always check info with a digital multimeter.
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burns25 
Member - Posts: 49
Member spacespace
Joined: March 09, 2005
Location: United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 10:57 PM / IP Logged  

You're just asking for a lawsuit.  Even if it's not a thief someone could be working on the car and accidently set it off and guess what big trouble for you. 

KarTuneMan 
Platinum - Posts: 7,056
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Joined: December 14, 2004
Location: Isle Of Man
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 10:58 PM / IP Logged  

Hard to imagine......that bloody crook has protection under the constitution. Hurt him and you'll go to jail.

You decide.......

Chris Luongo 
Platinum - Posts: 3,746
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Joined: May 21, 2002
Location: Massachusetts, United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 11:10 PM / IP Logged  
I'm not so sure people should be saying "that's illegal" without knowing what state you're from, or at least being able to cite chapter and section of their local/state law.
But think of the liability:
You park the car in a tow zone. Tow truck driver tries to gain access to the car's interior to releast the hood, release the parking brake, etcetera. Tow truck driver gets injured. Probably wouldn't work out too well for you.
Even if you don't park in tow zones, that's just an example.
You could park legally but get sick and not be able to retreive the car yourself. Valet parking attendant could lock the keys inside and try to get in.
pyroguy 
Member - Posts: 18
Member spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2007
Location: United States
Posted: April 10, 2007 at 11:40 PM / IP Logged  

Chris,

Valid points. However, I think there is some confusion of my intent.

My intent is to electrify a specific trim piece that must be removed for in order to accomplish one of two things:

1) Physical removal of the steering column from the car for the sake of maintanance (and obviously in this case the system would be deactivated, and certainly no tow truck driver or valet attendant would be doing this legally) or

2) Gaining illegal access to the steering column in order to steal the car (which is what this system is meant to prevent).

The devil is in the details and like all engineering designs (and I am an engineer) there is a certain amount of brainstorming involved in order to ascertain all the probable outcomes of a specific design. In this case I will not be electrifying the door handles - so little children and valet parking attendants will be safe, and I will not be electrifying the parking break - so tow truck drivers will be safe.

Let me recap - the intention is to electrify ONE specific trim piece in order to prevent a thief from gaining access to the steering column. Obviously anyone else who justifiably needs to get to the column will be notified by the owner of the car and the system will consequently be activated. (You wouldn't arm the alarm on your car, remove the fob from the key ring, and then pass the key ring to the mechanic who is about to work on your car would you? Would be just a little < face="Arial" >asinine). This system would only be active if the alarm has been triggered. NO other event would cause the system to arm.

Lastly, as I mentioned above to Auex, I would not serioulsy put this method of theft deterence into practice without fully understanding the legal repercussions of said system. (I am in the process of reading through all the Revised Missouri Statues from www.moga.mo.gov).

Again, thank you all for your comments! Please keep them coming.

- Jesse

auex 
Platinum - Posts: 5,041
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Joined: December 23, 2002
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: April 11, 2007 at 12:05 AM / IP Logged  
It's classification is assault and punishment is upto 10 years if injury occurs. I can find cases but can't find the actual statute. There is also case law in your state concerning it.
It was put that your property rights don't supercede human rights. I am tiRED / bored searching through legal jargon.
Even the autotaser that was out years ago is illegal in places.
Certified Security Specialist
Always check info with a digital multimeter.
I promise to be good.
Tell Darwin I sent you.
I've been sick lately, sorry I won't be on much.
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